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 Post subject: Celica TA60 or Corolla KE70
PostPosted: Mon Nov 09, 2009 7:05 pm 

Joined: Sun Nov 01, 2009 5:21 pm
Posts: 5
Location: Greece
Hello, awesome site you got here guys!! Really inspiring and really makes you love old ricers.
:roll:
Now to what I am really interested about. I am in search for a car and I was wondering what from the above is better choice. The car will be a daily driver and I am intending into turning it into a drift / track car. The car will be tuned little by little but my main concern is that since Corolla is almost same as the AE86 there are many ready parts such as top mounts, engine conversions, suspensions and so on...also tones of info on the net. On the Celica there are really very little info (I didn't even found something in here) but I kinda like it better since it is more jap style 80 street racer...hehe :twisted: Also a main concern if any of these cars are suspicious to rot on any point such as the KP60/61 Starlet rot badly at the rear arches.

Finally bomb me with any info you think I would want .

Cant wait to own my ricer


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Nov 10, 2009 7:35 pm 

Joined: Sun Nov 01, 2009 5:21 pm
Posts: 5
Location: Greece
Anyone... :roll:


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Nov 10, 2009 8:38 pm 
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Joined: Thu Jan 18, 2007 5:41 pm
Posts: 5592
Location: LA
Well you probably started off on the wrong by calling these cars ricers. In the US that's seen as a bad thing.

Most of us don't know how the market is in Greece, but old Celicas are plentiful here. If your goal is to build a drift car, go with the E70. Almost everything suspension-wise for the AE86 will fit.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Nov 10, 2009 10:16 pm 

Joined: Sun Nov 01, 2009 5:21 pm
Posts: 5
Location: Greece
ricer's bad... :lol: obviously didn't know about it.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Nov 10, 2009 11:26 pm 

Joined: Tue Jan 20, 2009 4:13 am
Posts: 31
Location: New Zealand
If you want to build a tough and competent car for the least amount of work, and you prefer the celica anyway, go with the celica!

I'm piecing together a carina which is an identical chassis, but different shaped body on top. So have picked up a few tricks along the way.

There are a few different motor/gearbox/diff/etc options that bolt straight in, or there abouts.

If you get some engine mounts from a 3AU powered AA60 then you can drop a 4AGE right in, swap the bellhousing on the standard T50 gearbox to a 4AGE one and you're sorted!

Some carinas also came factory with a W50 or W55 gearbox, so have big enough trans tunnel to accomodate those

Or if you get a crossemember/engine mounts from an SA60, you can fit an Altezza 3SGE engine straight in, including the 6 speed box if you remake the gearbox crossmember. You can use a W55 speedo drive to convert it to use the factory speedo cable, and factory T50 clutch slave cylinder bolts to the gearbox, just needs shaft lengthened.

Can also use Cressida (or similar) driveshafts to suit the W55 or 6 speed box, fits up sweet.

If you can find one, if you get an F series diff from an MA40 or RA60 or similar carina/celica/etc, it will bolt straight in.

Then an Altezza LSD bolts straight into this, heaps of aftermarket ones available.

Any other questions just ask, I've replaced just about everything on my carina with new or upgraded or reconditioned parts, so have a fair idea of what works and what doesnt!

There are a few tricks for suspension/brakes/etc, parts you can use from other cars.

Dunno if they were available/common where you are, but if you can find a TA63 model then they came factory with the 3TGTE engine, W55 (or was it w50...) gearbox, F series diff, (sometimes factory LSD) independant rear suspension, disc brakes all round... Pretty good car from the get go, built tough!


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Nov 11, 2009 10:34 am 
JNC Fanatic

Joined: Fri Dec 14, 2007 11:26 pm
Posts: 1101
Location: Detroit
ben wrote:
Well you probably started off on the wrong by calling these cars ricers. In the US that's seen as a bad thing.


Yes, it's a very insulting term, and these days a "ricer" is usually someone who puts silly wings, goofy wheels, clear taillights, 200 pounds of stereo equipment, graphics and body kits on their cars, and way-too-loud exhausts. :lol:

Furthermore- this smiley you're using (:roll:) tends to denote sarcasm, so it doesn't look particularly good. It's the motion of someone rolling their eyes.

That being said... I would personally go for the Celica. I really like that bodystyle, and there's much you can do with them. That, and you don't see to many of them around these days. I would head over to celicasupra.com (think that's what the forum is called, haha) if you wanted more information on those cars.

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Last edited by Stationwagonguy on Wed Nov 11, 2009 1:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Nov 11, 2009 12:34 pm 

Joined: Tue Jan 20, 2009 4:13 am
Posts: 31
Location: New Zealand
Aaaahhh well, back on topic.

Here are answers to some questions that I was asked via PM, I figure other people may want to know as well.

GFoto wrote:
First of all I am not familiar (yet) with the gearboxes codes (I know most of the engines),


Okay well basically...

A K series gearbox (K40 = 4 speed, K50 = 5 speed) is what comes in a KE70 standard, these arent very strong at all. These are also in the AE85s.
These have a cable clutch, which means to convert to a stronger gearbox you need to do a fair bit of mucking around.

A T series gearbox (T40 or T50) is what comes standard in the AE86, and also is the weakest/smallest gearbox available for the celica! Which is good. These have a hydraulic clutch setup. People swap these boxes into AE85s and KE70s etc to stop blowing up K series gearboxes!

A W series gearbox is a bigger/stronger gearbox... Very strong infact! These are the 'supra' gearboxes that people put behind 3-400hp V8 engines, turbo motors, etc. If you put one of these in your car, you'll be very unlucky to break it. These come factory fitted to the turbo versions of celica/carina/corona, 5 speed GX71 cressidas, and a whole whack of other 80s Toyotas. These will fit pretty well straight into a celica, where as to fit one into a KE70 is a pain in the ass, and so is fitting just a T series box! Which is standard for the celica 8)

Quote:
I am not going to have the car spotless or anything like it so I am not so interested is having the tacho cable working and stuff but It is important to be easy to have basic drift specs such.
It's pretty easy getting things like the tacho working!

Quote:
For the corolla there are bolt on adjustable top mounts, top mounts bars and everything. Are there any of these stuff available for the Celica (if you know of course)


Cusco still make brand new camber plates, strut braces, etc for the celica
surprisingly enough! I've got some cusco camber plates.

However the best way to go IMO, is to buy a full set of AE86 coilovers, like the BCs or something. The top plates have a different bolt pattern, but turning them around 180 degrees and redrilling 3 new holes into the top of the strut tower (after some careful measuring) is the way to go.
You just need to replace the existing steering arms with AE85/AE86 ones, then it all bolts in. You can also use aftermarket AE86 castor rods, if you want some that are rose jointed or whatever.
Another option is to buy the S13 silvia coilovers, and have the struts welded to the bottom part of cut down Celica struts.

Quote:
also for the Corolla you can find short shock absorbers so that you can ride really low but still having working area (did you understand?).

Short stroke AE92 shocks fit into the celica casings, are the best option. Rear shocks from an SW20 for the front, or Front GT4 shocks are also an option, but are shorter/lower than AE92.

Quote:
Also the guy that sells the Celica says it is 1600cc 87hp so will this gearbox be OK even with the stock 4AGE?


Yep, will be the same gearbox that the 4AGE celica uses anyway. 8)

Quote:
I've read that the Celica diffs have big diameter rear axles that are unbreakable in low powers since the diff is going to be welded not changed with an LSD.

Again, KE70 comes with a smaller diff (S series?) from factory compared to the celica. Minimum diff size that the celica comes with is T series, which is the same strength as used in the AE86. (You'd have to find an AE86 diff for the KE70, good luck with that)

Quote:
Do you know the weight of the Celica (i think it is 200kg lighter than corona TA60 - which never came to Greece btw)


Depends on the trim level etc, but approx between 1000-1200kg in standard guise. If stripped out for drifting/racing/whatever, I'd expect it to be around the 1000kg mark, or possibly lighter if using T series diff and gearbox, and a 4AGE.


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 Post subject: Re: Celica TA60 or Corolla KE70
PostPosted: Wed Nov 11, 2009 5:21 pm 
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Joined: Sat Sep 13, 2008 9:10 pm
Posts: 1381
Location: Boston, Assachusetts
GFoto wrote:
Hello, awesome site you got here guys!! Really inspiring and really makes you love old ricers.
:roll:
Now to what I am really interested about. I am in search for a car and I was wondering what from the above is better choice. The car will be a daily driver and I am intending into turning it into a drift / track car. The car will be tuned little by little but my main concern is that since Corolla is almost same as the AE86 there are many ready parts such as top mounts, engine conversions, suspensions and so on...also tones of info on the net. On the Celica there are really very little info (I didn't even found something in here) but I kinda like it better since it is more jap style 80 street racer...hehe :twisted: Also a main concern if any of these cars are suspicious to rot on any point such as the KP60/61 Starlet rot badly at the rear arches.

Finally bomb me with any info you think I would want .

Cant wait to own my ricer


You must be used to Hondas with ugly fitting kits and huge fart cans. Calling JNCs ricers is a negative in this forum, dude. Or lemme guess..... your a former muscle car owner and have just now discovered the goodness that is a JNC. :roll:

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 Post subject: Re: Celica TA60 or Corolla KE70
PostPosted: Wed Nov 11, 2009 11:15 pm 

Joined: Sun Nov 01, 2009 5:21 pm
Posts: 5
Location: Greece
KresSlyda180 wrote:
GFoto wrote:
Hello, awesome site you got here guys!! Really inspiring and really makes you love old ricers.
:roll:
Now to what I am really interested about. I am in search for a car and I was wondering what from the above is better choice. The car will be a daily driver and I am intending into turning it into a drift / track car. The car will be tuned little by little but my main concern is that since Corolla is almost same as the AE86 there are many ready parts such as top mounts, engine conversions, suspensions and so on...also tones of info on the net. On the Celica there are really very little info (I didn't even found something in here) but I kinda like it better since it is more jap style 80 street racer...hehe :twisted: Also a main concern if any of these cars are suspicious to rot on any point such as the KP60/61 Starlet rot badly at the rear arches.

Finally bomb me with any info you think I would want .

Cant wait to own my ricer


You must be used to Hondas with ugly fitting kits and huge fart cans. Calling JNCs ricers is a negative in this forum, dude. Or lemme guess..... your a former muscle car owner and have just now discovered the goodness that is a JNC. :roll:


No muscle cars here in Greece...hehe not a car owner yet but a daily Celica AT160 driver


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Nov 12, 2009 6:48 pm 
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Joined: Sun Aug 30, 2009 1:43 pm
Posts: 387
Location: Worst Covina
Also, for what it's worth this smiley :roll: translates as being somewhat disrespectful in English. One would roll their eyes if they disagreed with someone, and wanted to show their discontent.

I've noticed a lot of Europeans use it out of context. Just trying to lend a hand here.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Nov 13, 2009 5:54 am 

Joined: Sun Nov 01, 2009 5:21 pm
Posts: 5
Location: Greece
:roll: It's not considered bad AT ALL here and that's why I used it the first time. It's more like "I don't know" smiley here or pity...


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Nov 13, 2009 4:31 pm 
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Joined: Sun Aug 30, 2009 1:43 pm
Posts: 387
Location: Worst Covina
Ah gotcha! Yeah, I figured it's different everywhere.


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