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PostPosted: Sat Jul 03, 2010 4:21 am 
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Joined: Sat Jun 05, 2010 8:31 am
Posts: 199
Location: Somewhere in the desert, NM
Well, having gotten through inspection, I'll admit a got a bit lazy. I have enjoyed tootling around in the Laurel (as much as you can sweating your butt off). I have to admit it is fun, even here in Okinawa, everywhere I go there are people stopping and staring as it goes by. I'll be stuck in traffic, and there will be cars with one person in it pointing at it for the others to look. It's something I'm not used to at all... and probably never will be.
Anyways, I'm planning to pull the engine this coming Tuesday. I'll admit, it's still hard for me to think that I'll be taking it's original engine out, especially the times it's running nice and smooth... but not when it's not wanting to start, stalling out, struggling up some of the inclines, just acting up, etc. Either way, I really want to keep the engine so it can be restored if want to down the road.
So, in the lack of engine removal pics, I figured I'd post a pic of the donor 180SX the SR20DET is coming from:
The donor car... can you guess what happened to it?

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Last edited by KC30 on Sat Sep 18, 2010 1:11 am, edited 3 times in total.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Jul 03, 2010 5:06 pm 

Joined: Sun Nov 16, 2008 1:37 am
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Location: utah
Love the car, and support people doing what they want with there car because they own it, but i may have to avoid the thread as soon as the motor is pulled, although im sure you will do a great job, it pains me a little to see that very rare car have an sr20 in it :) but anyway sweet car and good luck on the swap, it should be a very fun car.


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 Post subject: Today, the Laurel starts earning the 2000 GX badges it wears
PostPosted: Sat Jul 10, 2010 9:25 am 
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Location: Somewhere in the desert, NM
Well, today I started the engine/front suspension swap I've been looking forward to, and not at the same time. As most of you know or have seen, I have been torn about this swap, very much looking forward to breathing new life in the old Laurel, giving it the engine and performance it deserves. But at the same time, not taking lightly the removal of the original engine, at times lamenting that fact very heavily.
But it was time to commit to updating the Laurel, and truly facing that I would not be able to keep the old G18 running.
So of course, there's pics: Like the Laurel's last pic with the G18 powering (and I use that word VERY loosely) it.
Image
And yes, there is a Chevelle SS sitting in the background.
The G18 and front suspension out The HUGE A/C compressor is not pictured... due to not being able to remove the engine with it still on (due to being so big) and that it's so big it mounts to the engine AND the body! Also, taking a good look at the engine when it was out, it was very ready for a rebuild... making me wonder how long it would have lasted, and how hard and expensive it will be. Again, if I could find all the parts I would need!
The SR20DET waiting to go in.
The hole left behind, waiting to be filled by new suspension and engine
The new S14 crossmember mounted, with S13 lower arms
The crossmember was mounted using the Laurel's existing crossmember mount points. And the lower arms were mounted inward on the crossmember, 1" on each side to shorten the 6" that were added to the track width by the S14/S13 suspension.
The S13 brakes
The S13 brakes again, and the S13 KYB coil overs
Up on the lift, from behind
On the lift again, great view of the results from trailing arm suspension
The great looking front end, waiting to get back on the road
Image
The S14 crossmember and the power steering something new for the Laurel, and that I am looking forward to.
The power steering linkage waiting to be connected.
The new coil overs have camber plates, adjusted to the outermost setting to help correct the camber caused by the wider track width.
The new hubs, waiting for the new(er) Watanabe 15x6.5 wheels and planning to fit 195/50R15 tires.

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PostPosted: Sat Jul 10, 2010 2:31 pm 
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you have used the correct mounting points for the subframe, if you would have taken the other hole on the subframe the wheels would be to far to the front, thats what i did at first fit.
rest is looking good, everything bolts on there quite nice :)

i'd like to see what you will do to et the tension rods fitted properly.
that is the thing i am struggeling with right now and the only thing that is holding me back to get the rest finished.

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PostPosted: Sun Jul 11, 2010 7:43 am 
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Location: Somewhere in the desert, NM
Well, today I tackled too much for only having 8 hours to do it. Started off with planning to install the sway bar, then go and get stuff to start installing the tension rods... But of course that didn't happen.
I stopped and bought hardware for the sway bar mount... the wrong size. So, we decided to skip that, and figured should test fit the engine and see what other hardware we needed. So we installed the SR, fit tight on the firewall, and looked sexy as hell:
Image
But how the engine fit, it looked like the transmission was unlikely to fit. So we tried to fit the transmission, not going to happen with the engine installed. So we tried pulling the engine and installing the trans and engine together... yep, it didn't fit.
By the time we figured all this stuff out, it was about time to get going for the parts needed for the suspension before the places closed. So, now some plans are changing slightly. The transmission is very likely to be changed out with an RB20's. Which is same gearing, but the transmission is 2" shorter including the shifter being located 2" forward of the SR's Which will help out. I'm considering moving the engine forward, which would be an easy fix... but the turbo's exit pipe is ideally located right now, and if the engine's shifted forward, the pipe will be exiting right above the old suspension's aft tension rod mount. A little more to sort out.
But, the goal tomorrow is to sort out the new S13's suspension's tension rod mounting... and probably buy an R32's RB20 transmission.

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 Post subject: Going slowly, get there eventually
PostPosted: Wed Jul 14, 2010 8:00 am 
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Location: Somewhere in the desert, NM
Well, as expected really, things are progressing pretty slow. Due to some of the issues to sort out, I'd come to the realization that I would not be able to put the S13 rear sub-frame in before I get the car sent off. So I had to come up with an alternate plan to handle the SR20's power with the stock rear subframe. The stock setup is a 3.7 open diff. So I looked around and happened across this:
A Subaru Forester...
and a S/Tb STI one at that
From what kinda sketchy info I can find, it should be a 4.44 vLSD rear diff:
The diff
Which should suit my needs for now. It'll be very good acceleration, and calculates to a 150mph top speed... which I have NO intention of going near with only front lap belts in the car!
Also, to sort out the transmission issue, I did pick up an RB20's 5-speed. So I'll be putting on the SR's bell housing and seeing if it fits this weekend. The bonus of getting the RB 5-speed is that the speedometer cable will hook right up... but doesn't really matter with the new rear diff ratio. Though I can have a cheat sheet with what speeds are actually what hanging next to the speedo... that'll be fun explaining to a police man.
Anyways, still unsure if the current engine mounting location will work, but wanting to keep it because the turbo exhaust exit location is ideal with it, I have been looking for engine mount options. I came across solid mounts that also lower the position of the engine, good for clearance... but of course backordered 2 weeks plus shipping time. So, I'll have to see how this trans fits... fingers crossed.
I am closer to sorting out the tension rods, got an idea that I will be testing out this weekend as well. In the meantime, I mounted the rest of the steering/suspension. Due to the lower control arms being mounted inward, the steering arms were to long and the wheels wouldn't toe straight. So the steering arms had to be shortened an inch each as well. The result is about the perfect tire location with the new 15" Watanabes... though I still have to install camber bolts to correct the final camber:
Image
Where the Watanabe's will be sitting when on the ground (have to adjust coil over height of course)
the side view The top will be out a little more due to final camber adjustment, but it should look sexy as hell like that!

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 Post subject: Re: Going slowly, get there eventually
PostPosted: Wed Jul 14, 2010 5:55 pm 
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KC30 wrote:
From what kinda sketchy info I can find, it should be a 4.44 vLSD rear diff, Which should suit my needs for now.


What are you planning for drive axles?

Quote:
The bonus of getting the RB 5-speed is that the speedometer cable will hook right up... but doesn't really matter with the new rear diff ratio. Though I can have a cheat sheet with what speeds are actually what hanging next to the speedo...


FYI, Nissan sells a variety of speedo pinion gears that you can install to correct the speedo. :wink:


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PostPosted: Thu Jul 15, 2010 3:28 am 
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KC30 - it's a pity you are not answering PMs, so I will ask you in thread - do you plan to sell yours G18 engine? 8)

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Jul 15, 2010 8:08 am 
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Location: Somewhere in the desert, NM
Glomerus wrote:
KC30 - it's a pity you are not answering PMs, so I will ask you in thread - do you plan to sell yours G18 engine? 8)

Sorry about that, been crazy running around trying to find parts the last several days and forgot to follow up. I'm currently not selling the engine, as I'm planning to ship all parts back with the car so it can be returned to original spec down the road. That's one of the reason's I've been careful not to modify the body in any way if at all possible. So far it's worked, the crossmember is using the old mount points, the sway bar connected to the factory sway bar location as well. Next is the tension rod mounts, should be without body mod, and I think I have found a way to mount an intercooler behind the grill without cutting holes for piping.

Datsunfreak: For the drive axles, though not ideal, I will be running the stock ones for now. That's something I will have to upgrade after getting it to the US, if I decide to skip the S13 rear. Also, thanks for the info about the speedo pinion gears, I'll have to look into that as I want to keep the stock gages.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Jul 15, 2010 6:56 pm 
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KC30 wrote:
Datsunfreak: For the drive axles, though not ideal, I will be running the stock ones for now. That's something I will have to upgrade after getting it to the US, if I decide to skip the S13 rear.


FYI, on the later Viscous LSD diffs, using the stock stubs and axles will make the car able to move/drive but will not engage the LSD.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Jul 16, 2010 6:48 am 
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Location: Somewhere in the desert, NM
Another step closer, but still slow and not quite there. I installed the SR's bell housing on the RB's transmission:
Hybrid SR/RB transmission
Test fitted, and the engine was only an inch from being installed. The angle of the engine/trans has it catching on the clutch master cylinder. So, lower profile engine mounts will help, but still not quite ideal. And I can't get those in a short time either. So my plan of using the R32's crossmember is going to be tested.

As far as the new rear diff, I haven't heard before about the new vLSDs not working with different stub shafts. Is there any word why that happens? For other vLSDs I've dealt with, the stub shaft had no effect on the viscous part. And from what pics I've seen of the two side by side, I don't see anything that would make the rear viscous or not. Just trying to find out so I can see what options I'm left with.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Jul 16, 2010 8:13 am 
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the subaru diff is a direct replacement for the std diff?

i dont get what you are trying to do with the r32 gearbox, what is the benefit of using it?

cant you just put the speedsignalpickup thingy from the r32 transmission into the speedsignal hole from the sr20 transmission?

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 Post subject: Another day down, another day kinda not really closer
PostPosted: Sat Jul 17, 2010 5:37 am 
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Location: Somewhere in the desert, NM
Ok, so today I had three goals, sort out the rear diff, see about using the R32 crossmember and sort out the front suspension (tension rods) finally.
So I started with the diff. And I see that unlike other models, I can't use these stub shafts. The new forester diff ones are spring clip install, so my stubs, with the big open hole in the center won't work. So I'll be riding the stock one for now.
Then I moved on to the R32 crossmember idea, and that will not work either. The S14's sits too far back, the R32's sits too far forward. So on to custom engine mounts.
In the meantime, I worked on the front suspension, to finish the tension rods and steering linkage.
I figured out the steering linkage, using R32 steering shaft will be shortened, should be able to finish that tomorrow. For the tension rods, I had picked up the S14 tension rod brackets, looking to modify them. So I came up with this:
Tension rod bracket view 1
Tension rod bracket view 2
Tension rod bracket view 3
Tension rod bracket view 4
Here's how it fits:
Tension rod installed

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Jul 17, 2010 5:46 am 
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Location: Somewhere in the desert, NM
Eric wrote:
i dont get what you are trying to do with the r32 gearbox, what is the benefit of using it??

Well, my original hopes were that the R32 trans would allow the engine to fit with the crossmember position and stock engine mounts. It was SO close, the only thing that stopped it was the intake manifold started to hit the clutch master cylinder. And the frustrating thing was if I could have gotten it into the mount, it would have fit... it was just trying to clear the engine mount studs.
The R32 trans definitely fits the tunnel better though, it's two inches shorter, and if I had gotten the engine in, the shifter was still in the cut out. Also the rear housing is 1/2 narrower at the tail area, just more room for everything.
Now that I'm moving the engine slightly forward, the benefit is that the shifter will be very close to the original location, and that I can just install the speedo cable mechanically. Of course, for the speedo, I could have done that by installing the mechanical speedo gear from the R32 trans into the SR20's.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Jul 17, 2010 12:20 pm 
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I dont think your tensionrod bracket will hold when you are driving the car. the std. s14 brackets are the size they are because they need to be like that, when you excellerate and brake all the weight from the car is going to your tensionrods and brackets. i think you need to make them way bigger/stiffer/more massive, dont know the exact english words for it.

i do like thge fact of putting mechanical speedo pickup form the r32 into the sr20 transmission.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Jul 17, 2010 2:50 pm 
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To get your speedo working right you just need to find a drive gear (in the gearbox) that goes with your diff.
It is only a 10mm bolt and the whole thing just pops out of the gearbox.
Count the teeth on the one that comes out and go from there.
DR30s, R31s, R32s, and all sorts of other Nissans all use the same drive with a different tooth count.
When you take yours out though, make sure you have another one to put in, or you empty the oil out of the gearbox.
Otherwise it acts as a drain and you'll get stinky gearbox oil all over your face, tuxedo etc.

Hooks

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 Post subject: Re: Another day down, another day kinda not really closer
PostPosted: Sat Jul 17, 2010 9:07 pm 
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KC30 wrote:
So I started with the diff. And I see that unlike other models, I can't use these stub shafts. The new forester diff ones are spring clip install, so my stubs, with the big open hole in the center won't work. So I'll be riding the stock one for now.


That's what I was getting at. The stock style axles only work well with the older non-viscous LSD. :tu:


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 Post subject: On the ground again
PostPosted: Sun Jul 18, 2010 7:53 am 
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Well, today I tried to get where I should have been last weekend. Which is getting the car on the ground, able to roll. I made some progress, I finally got the front suspension all tightened up, I've got a steering shaft rigged up, but won't be able to put it in until tomorrow. I am still iffy about the front tension rod mounts, like you said Eric. I'll be keeping an eye on it when it's able to drive.
Today I also started grafting up the engine mounts. I should have them built tomorrow, then urethane filled/coated and cure for a couple of days.
In the meantime, here's a pic of the old girl back on the ground again, with a new stance:
Image

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Jul 18, 2010 12:13 pm 
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you are a hard worker :)

what size wheels do you have? they seems to fit just under the arches?

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Jul 19, 2010 3:17 am 

Joined: Thu Mar 04, 2010 2:42 am
Posts: 76
Location: Adelaide, SA
Hey mate nice car. Have you ever thought about using a MADDAT SR20 fitting kit? they make an engine and gearbox cross member that will bolt straight into a 1600/510. Im not sure whether your car is the same dimensions as a 510 but if it is it would be a simple bolt in. Also you will be able to retain the standard SR box and im pretty sure too get the speedo hooked up u put a 200B input into the SR box and the standard speedo cable plugs into this. Hope this helps. Regards Matt


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